Stargazer Mecha Discussion

Gaiar · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 10:13 am Post subject: Stargazer Mecha Discussion

They have started releasing official information of the weapons of the mobile suites from Stargazer with the Strike Noir.

GAT-X105E Strike Noir

Background: A Close-Combat Mobile Suit based on the GAT-X105 Strike.

Specs:
Power Source: Battery?
Creator: Actaeon Industries
Allegiance: Earth Alliance(Phantom Pain)
Armor: Variable Phase Shift

Armaments:
Beam Pistol x 2
Anti-Beam Swords x 2 (Stored in Wing-Binders)
Beam Cannons x 2 (Stored in Wing-Binders, under Swords

Piloted by: Sven Cal Bayan

so it seems they may end up trying to suprise us by having the strike noir end up being powered by a source other then a battery, though its looking like it wont make use of the strike packs as the origional strike did nor the attachments the Impulse had. Im looking forward to seeing it in action myself personally.
_________________

I would like to thank Limyc for the banner.

when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth

Soultaker7 · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 12:23 pm Post subject:

Okay...
How about we do this like we once did with Destiny - use the Mobile Suit Discussion thread to talk about mechs we already know about and/or that have already aired as well as the official pieces information falling in drop by drop while we keep the Mobile Suit Speculation thread about the MSes that aren't either already known or who are still too mysterious for us NOT to consider the given chat here as speculation instead of discussion.

If the other mods disagree, well, feel free to add any additional guideline, amendment or whatnot to complement this thread and prevent redundancies with the other thread.

^Mmmh...other than that, well, what's new apart the fact that the once railguns slung under the wing binders are now known as beam cannons? VPS - well, alright but unless they give the SN a different color scheme I don't see how this is gonna matter unless of course you start considering ways to increase the operation time as well as the reduction of power expenditure.
And...didn't Gunota mention a "small rocket anchor" in the SN's panoply? A sort of Panzer Eizen spinoff IIRC...

Other note: I wonder why Orb commissioned Actaeon Industries to build the SN while Morgenroete could have done so since they have experience from the creation of the Strike Rouge --> hence the Strike Noir (both being French color names, mind you, so...well...). But then again if you remember the fact that FN Manufacturing (American subsidiary of the Belgian FN Herstal (Fabrique Nationale de Herstal)) is the one manufacturing the M16A2 assault rifle for the U.S. ground forces despite the fact that the creator and original holder of the patent is COLT Manufacturing (actually, Colt made a very low offer to the U.S. Army and the military chose another, more cajoling company to produce the M16A2 so the scenario for Strike Noir might be the same) it is not so unplausible. The only thing I don't know yet is whether Actaeon holds Morgenroete as an affiliate or is in some sort acquainted with Orb - its other only creation, the Gel Finieto, was never used by Orb (because of its comparatively disappointing combat performances) but the company sold the Mirage Colloid Virus technology not to Orb but to EA and some others...
_________________

Gundam Folder & General Moderator
This is what I am - SO ACCURATE! ZOMG! O_O

Sketch · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 12:49 pm Post subject:

i agree and i'm pretty sure that no one will disagree.

with that said.

Thread converted..

For more info, look at Soultaker's post

So for now, if i'm right, you guys can discuss Strike Noir, Buster Kai and Duel Kai here. =)

Edit: you heard him. Only those babies can be discussed here for now.
S7

Seed Force · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 4:28 pm Post subject:

By the way is it just me or do the nozzles on the Strike Noir beam gun look a tad small to me?

http://www.g-seed.com/index.php?action=star_story

I mean you see the beam gun which is already quit esmall and then you take a look at the nozzle and its tiny. It looks like that gun can only shoot out thin laser beams based on what I'm seeing although I'm sure its going to be like all the other units and just shoot out standard sized beams.

Speculation: It's possible but I hope it won't happen. Strike Noir may possibly use the frame for Strike Freedom shooting dual guns as its way of utilizing both of its beam nozzles. When it uses its swivel cannons on the back the animation may be taken from Saviour or Blast Impulse. I'm just saying this because there were stolen graphics between Seed and Destiny too. For example, the ZAKU Phantom utilized by Rey attacked the Exass the same way the Freedom attacked the Providence.
_________________

Join Gundam Triple Triad!!

Klaha Sama · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 5:37 pm Post subject:

Instead of two beam rifles the Strike Noir has two beam pistols which I find kind of weird considering I don't think we have seen too many beam pistols in Gundam Seed and Gundam Seed Destiny. The more information I hear about the Strike Noir the more I wonder why they even bothered calling it Strike Noir. Maybe just calling it the Noir Gundam didn't cut it. This is supposed to be based on the Strike Gundam but I just don't see the similarities. When we were first introduced to Impulse in Gundam Seed Destiny we could see the similarities in looks and weaponry. I mean from the looks of it Strike Noir doesn't have any packs that are interchangeable with it which was the big thing with Strike and Impulse. I looked at the mechanics part of the web site Seed Force posted and according to that site Strike Noir's weaponry include Beam Pistol x 2, Anti-Beam Swords x 2 (Stored in Wing-Binders) and Beam Cannons x 2 (Stored in Wing-Binders, under Swords).

Derringer · Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 9:48 pm Post subject:

Seed Force · Posted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:22 am Post subject:

Could it be said that the word Strike was just added as another marketting gimmick? Strike Freedom, a combination of both the Strike and the Freedom in terms of names and still piloted by the same guy, that should sell well. Add a infinite to Justice and it should be expected to do pretty good. Now let's do it again with the Strike name, but instead of Freedom let's make it Noir. Then let's slap on the names Kai behind Buster and Duel since the members miss those units and it should at least bring in a tad more cash.
_________________

Join Gundam Triple Triad!!

Soultaker7 · Posted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 9:30 am Post subject:

Note: if French, 'Noir' means 'Black', probably a wink at the color scheme the SN features. And yeah, 'Noir' also points to the Striker pack strapped on its back although I wonder why EA would choose such a bleak name for a piece of equipment like that. I mean, most names are either fitting or more or less related to the said piece of equipment (Mjollnir: Thor's hammer - fitting for the Raider's self-propelled hull breaker) but this time...bleagh.
And 'Noir' is probably a follow-up to the Strike Rouge since 'Rouge' in French means 'Red' - pointing to the different color scheme obtained by the power saving device in the SR's frame, which causes the PSA to take on reddish hues because of the different power feed.
And yep, Klaha, if the SN can accept a Striker Pack, then it can accept a variety of other packs like Launcher, Aile or Sword since the hardpoints on the back are configured for the Striker Pack family. You can liken it to the U.S. Army's Piccatinny-Weaver Mil-Std 1913 rail interface system (RIS) - a system that allows the user to customize his weapon with his own choice of equipment for specific missions. However, I do not keep hope on seeing the SN changing packs - the Noir Pack is what roughly defines the SN and it'd be like SF not using his DRAGOONs or beam rifles but IJ's subflight lifter instead.
_________________

Gundam Folder & General Moderator
This is what I am - SO ACCURATE! ZOMG! O_O

Seed Force · Posted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 5:32 pm Post subject:

From what I can see though of the unit it seems to be a pretty solid unit that doesn't seem like it can just as easily discard its pack in exchange for another one. Due to the short length of the series I assume that we aren't going to be seeing too much switching, or any switching at all throughout the series as a whole.
_________________

Join Gundam Triple Triad!!

deakra · Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 10:54 pm Post subject:

It's been a long time since i've been in here so hy peeps.. Ermm i've read in mahq that in Stargazer there's a Buster Kai.. so i presume that the one that was in seed was the same buster with new modification? if so than does Stargazer relate highly upon Orb's weapon development? It's kinda wierd seing a highly modification of MS between Seed Destiny when u think about it. Why? yeah well where were those MS when Destiny start? Gundam is taking new ground on making their fans have a headache.. anyway's i'm gonna wait for Stargazer coz it has Buster innit.
_________________
For The Preservation Of Our Blue & Pure World.

ZGMF-X20A:Strike_Freedom · Civilian Joined: 02 May 2006 Posts: 15 191 Units

I thought Stargazer was goning to be a proto-type of Destroy. And now i know its like a testment of strike freedom. So does this mean that strike freedom is stronger than infinite justice?

Sigma · Posted: Wed May 03, 2006 1:18 am Post subject:

Buster Kai and Duel Kai are new units based off the designs of the old ones, no?

Oh, and:

Soultaker7 · Posted: Wed May 03, 2006 3:17 am Post subject:

Headache alert.

1. There is nothing linking Stargazer to Destroy - both are made by different factions, one being a belligerant coalition of Naturals (EA/OMNI) and the other a mixed conglomeration of scientists who declared themselves neutral in the war (DSSD).

Moreover I'd find it extremely unlikely if not preposterous to believe that Stargazer is in some way related to Destroy just on the basis of their respective roles - one is a research platform presumably (seeing DSSD's endeavor to promote interstellar travel and the exploration of the solar system) focusing on high speed and maneuvrability performances (as a result of many a research on high-speed propulsion) while the other is a walking fortress that lumbers around and doesn't have the slightest ounce of nimbleness, even in zero gravity situation (space).
Other than that Stargazer is touted to be a MS of 'normal' dimensions with possibly limited weaponry (as DSSD is only supposed to be like a NASA spinoff, not a private U.S. Air Force wannabe - hence no need to carry high level weaponry) while the Destroy finds its strength in its bulk and the wide panoply its girth can carry around.

The only MSes the Destroy could find its ancestry in would possibly be the GAT-X252 Forbidden (flipping-over, saucer-like protection hood/helm), GAT-X131 Calamity (chest cannons) and maybe the ZGMF-X11A Regenerate for the experience gained with maneuvering massive MSes around (remember that the Regenerate was unrivaled in size until the Destroy's appearance and the only prototype known was captured by EA after it was disabled by Lowe Gear and his teammates).

Others points: 'testament'?
Meaning(s) - taken from http://www.thefreedictionary.com/testament:
1. Something that serves as tangible proof or evidence: The spacious plan of the city is a testament to the foresight of its founders.
2. A statement of belief; a credo: my political testament.
3. Law A written document providing for the disposition of a person's property after death; a will.
4. Testament Bible Either of the two main divisions of the Bible.
5. Archaic A covenant between humans and God.

I think the word you're searching for is not 'testment' but prototype, testbed or demonstrator.
So far speculation spurred from a Gundam Ace (or I think it comes from there) magazine points the Stargazer as the mystery MS reportedly linked to Strike Freedom's development; couple this with the fact that DSSD would logically be delving in studies about high output thrusters and maneuvrability systems and you have a scenario easy to put together - but no confirmation of that yet.

The ZGMF-X12A Testament is in no way linked to Strike Freedom as it doesn't appear in the anime but only in the Astray sidestories - it doesn't even make a cameo appearance in some screenshot or whatnot as the manga is virtually independent from the anime but the opposite doesn't hold true (the Astray manga explains lots of mysteries that weren't explained in the anime).
Note that at one time people believed the Testament to be a MS made from the remains of the wrecked ZGMF-X10A Freedom from Jachin Due but that assumption suffered a quick, bitter death when the schematics were released - the ZGMF-X12A Testament is a wholly different MS.

As for the SF > IJ thingy we already did that many times before in the versus threads and other mecha topics. Basically the two are units with different roles (SF is more or less a medium-to-long-ranges-specialized interceptor focusing on gunnery while IJ is a medium-to-short-ranges-specialized juggernaut laden with beam sabers) so it'd be a bit unfair to compare the two knowing that they complement each other in battle instead of having been created to fight each other or units of comparable capabilities and the like. Aside from that I fail to see how having Stargazer as a POSSIBLE demonstrator for SF makes SF any way stronger than IJ. Nothing tells us that there wasn't a hypothetical demonstrator for IJ too.

Note: and oh, em, btw, this thread is only for mechs that have already been aired or which we already know enough...meaning that Strike Noir, Duel Kai and Buster Kai can be discussed here. Stargazer and the two other mechs should be chatted about in the MS Speculation topic. Thanks.
_________________

Gundam Folder & General Moderator
This is what I am - SO ACCURATE! ZOMG! O_O

Gorlen · Posted: Fri May 12, 2006 1:33 am Post subject:

Here are some pics for he disscussion
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v137/gorlen/busterkai.jpg <--- Buster Kai
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v137/gorlen/duelkai.jpg <----- Duel Kai
and or course

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v137/gorlen/gat-x105e.jpg <---- GAT-X105E Strike Noir

Unit type: mobile suit
Equipment: Variable Phase Shift (VPS), enhanced power unit
Armament: CIWS x 2, beam gun x 2, Noir Striker (beam sword x 2, railgun x 2)

thats all I know for the Mechas. I do hope they do bring back Buster and Duel though.

I must say on the Buster Kai pic, the head of the MS looks awfully weird. Anybody have any info on it?

http://www.mahq.net/Mecha/Gundam/index.htm <---- origin of pics
_________________

Soultaker7 · Posted: Fri May 12, 2006 6:49 am Post subject:

http://img283.imageshack.us/my.php?image=11459789585257ww.jpg

Here's an updated musings list on the two suits, just to spur some discussion here.

1st thoughts:
- Duel Kai:
- - Comparison with the original Duel Shroud.

Looks like a retake of the Duel with the Shroud add-on from ZAFT. I surmise that EA created the Duel Kai after the Duel was handed back to the Earth Alliance to reportedly be scrapped as a concession for the J7 treaty - so tough luck on having them back, Gorlen.

On top of that, if the Strike (piloted by none other than Kira Yamato) was quite on par with the brand new ZAFT mobile suits then you can wonder whether the Duel or the Buster would be outstanding two years after their creation. Technology had made great leaps and IMO it's better to create new suits than try to beef up some MSes whose technological expansion potential might be limited. Better off rebuilding them from scratch instead of compromising with the limits of an old, outdated frame.

Continuing from the thought above I find myself facing a quandary as to why they discarded (provided they just improved the Duel Shroud) the Duel Shroud's 115mm Shiva railgun and replaced it by an additional missile pack. Although the MP allows fire-and-forget and multi-lock salvoes, a railgun might still yield higher velocity and therefore higher kinetic energy for the warheads, although the missiles have an advantage known as the ability to maneuver in midflight and detonate as close to the target as possible in case of a close miss due to the said target's evasive maneuvers. Although heat and shockwaves do quite a number on conventional armor, solid projectiles like warheads fitted with pyrophoric depleted uranium can still pierce quite sturdy surfaces and if not totally, then cause important stress fractures in the armor or internal damage due to the impact. If a hand-thrown and rocket-propelled explosive stiletto from a Windam can blast the Freedom's shield apart then a railgun's shell could maybe yield comparable effect, right?
-- Especially against units that are NOT equipped with PSA. PSA-fitted mobile suits are for aces only and I guess beam sabers and rifles are paramount to counter and destroy them - instead of kinetic energy weapons.

The cockpit area seems less protected and the Shroud seems lighter - maybe for greater agility? The cockpit has seen its outer layer reinforced because Kira had proved that it was possible to get close to the MS and deal lots of damage to the cockpit - consequently endangering the pilot's life.
Why put the shield on the shoulder? Unless it's a mount for when the Duel is not fighting I suppose the pilot would rather bear it in the MS' hand so that he can maneuver the shield around according to the threat's azimuth...unless it hints to the Duel's hands (both of them) being free for some other task. Twin rifles, again?
...Nah. Can't be. Would be overdone (SF and Buster Kai).
Thrusters seem the same - the outgrowth (the fin-like thingy on the back to vector the exhaust gasses directly comes from the Duel Shroud, which comforts me in the feeling that DK is a direct descendant of DS.
Both beam sabers are now relocated to the hips instead of behind the shoulders - probably so that the pilot can draw them out faster.
The constructs on the forearms are maybe missile pods - or grapples? They seem strange somehow or they might just be mounts for the shield in case the pilot decides to switch its position on the other side.

- Buster Kai:
- - Comparison with the original Buster.

Hmmm...interesting one.
The face seems to have a different forehead design with that helm-like thingy covering the eyes instead of the forehead and V-fin antenna complex. Protection against recoil and whatnot? I suppose they're coated with antibeam coating otherwise it'd be useless - but it'd be a great addition knowing that...certain pilots like to cripple MSes by robbing them of their video feed and therefore preventing the pilots from piloting safely.
V-fin has also changed - reminds me a bit of Testament but I guess it's because of the mask thingamajig.
The chest is different - to the point that it brings to memory the design of the F91 from UC. Maybe they refurbished the engines/cooling system inside or decided to try a different cockpit configuration? Maybe it's just for added protection.
The shoulder systems seem bulkier for added capacity - therefore more missiles to bring out. Definitely fitting for an artillery system.
Looks like there are Duel Shroud fin-like constructs on the backpack judging from those beige thingies sticking out. Additional thrusters? Why not - an artillery system must be able to get to the firing zone ASAP and I guess the addition would be a welcome one.
The cannons look really like shortened versions of the previous models - and I wonder if they can flip backwards onto a horizontal position like for the Freedom's Balaena positron cannons, to take up less space or if they'll just remain like that just like for the Calamity. Looks like there are pylons on the back to help the aiming - probably pointing to the fact that it's really not a shoot-everywhere-and-if-you're-lucky-you'll-hit-something-teehee MS but more like a Freedom-spinoff. Who knows? Maybe they took the idea from there judging how devastating the ZGMF-X10A was during the Orb invasion.
The sideways-facing shoulder pads are no longer there. Now they've been replaced by apogee thrusters for greater agility and sharper maneuvers...it is also possible that they've been added to make up for the gained weight (two new weapons).
The rifles...although the aiming pylons on the hips only serve as storage hardpoints now it seems that they are more maneuverable (therefore lightweight) than the previous models, whose improved versions are now relocated topside despite their relatively big dimensions. I've got the feeling that although they might be medium-to-long-range weapons, they are optimized for potential CQB although not really for dogfight - but just in case an enemy MS gets too close - unless the wide arc the weapons can be swiveled through indicate that the BK was meant to take on VERY large battlefields with units spread afar. BTW, who's got the feeling that there is an additional weapon under the rifles' barrels, just like for the DOMs? Maybe it's a multiphase or a positron cannon - just like for the DOM's multiplex bazooka system (with a cannon underneath the barrel).
_________________

Gundam Folder & General Moderator
This is what I am - SO ACCURATE! ZOMG! O_O

Strike Destiny · Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 10:27 am Post subject:

In 2 of the pictures here on HG Strike Noir there seem to show wires from its backpack, legs/sole and hands which I think may be new weapons. I find it strange for it to located on its backpack and its sole.
http://www.gundambase.com/community/news_view.asp?news_idx=133
_________________

Soultaker7 · Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 11:49 am Post subject:

Those are supposed to be the rocket anchors announced by Gunota but which he haven't seen yet - unless Raven finally scans that Hobby magazine he says to have SN schematics showing all weapons in action and posts the pics here. Confused

_________________

Gundam Folder & General Moderator
This is what I am - SO ACCURATE! ZOMG! O_O

Derringer · Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 12:19 pm Post subject:

Hehehe, it looks it uses the same little hooks that are present on the N Dagger N.

http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/2421/page1727kb.jpg

Knolly · Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 12:51 pm Post subject:

Seed Force · Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 1:39 pm Post subject:

Ooo it has anchors now on different points of its body. However my question would be how effective would these anchors really be because they don't seem to have any beam tips to them for deep penetration against PS armored enemies however the normal grappling hook could prove to be an interesting tool kinda like how the GOUF's Heat Rod worked in destroying items too.
_________________

Join Gundam Triple Triad!!

Derringer · Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 3:58 pm Post subject:

Those things have fairly strong penetrating power. The N Dagger N was able to anchor itself to moving space debris using those. On the previous page, the same set of hooks was used to hack into an informant's shuttle about Armory One.

http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/7387/page1696he.jpg

ZGMF-X20 Strike Freedom · Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 5:13 pm Post subject:

Derringer · Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 9:47 pm Post subject:

It's from Zeonic Corps' release of Destiny Astray

Soultaker7 · Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 3:41 am Post subject:

Just a question spur some discussion:

Judging from the pics here:
http://www.gundambase.com/sonhyungki/newitem/hg_noir/9.jpg
http://www.gundambase.com/sonhyungki/newitem/hg_noir/5.jpg

- Do you believe, although we will probably never get to see it since all battles will be in space (as I assume), the Strike Noir has some atmospherical flight capabilities, comparable to the old Strike or greater? The Strike Rouge was able to have sustained flight in Destiny thanks to a possibly upgraded, beefed Aile pack, although in SEED the performances of that booster system only allowed the MS to do flea jumps and speed bursts. However, seeing the presence of wings (which also double as equipment racks) - do you think there is a possibility for the Strike Rouge to become airborne like Strike Rouge and be capable of sustained aerial dogfight or do you believe that, much like the original Strike, its flight capabilities are restricted and the wings are there as gimmicks or just for aesthetics?
_________________

Gundam Folder & General Moderator
This is what I am - SO ACCURATE! ZOMG! O_O

Razor.the.red · Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 6:04 am Post subject:

As far as I know, the wings house only a pair of Beam Cannons and two Anti-Ship Swords, no extra thrusters. I don't think the Noir Striker Pack enables full atmospherical flight.
_________________

Alternatively, take a look at teh art gallery!

	Gundam Seed Forum Index -> Gundam Seed Stargazer	All times are GMT - 5 Hours Goto page 1, 2, 3 ... 11, 12, 13 Next
Page 1 of 13